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 Side Reed Motor...

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mjpowell

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Number of posts : 1074
Localisation : Lincoln England
Registration date : 2006-12-09

PostSubject: Side Reed Motor...   Wed Sep 12, 2012 7:10 am

Thought I'd re-post some pic's of Tom's sprint motor (some in my frame) Aswell as pic's
of the motor's bottom end with different size crank wheel's ; there are some pic's of the top
end too... The side reed as a concept is OK but if you look closely you will see many an
interesting thing?? Next year it may have the exhaust out the back too ...
Please pass comment.. Many Thanks to Tom












Last edited by mjpowell on Sat Sep 22, 2012 7:25 am; edited 3 times in total
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john bass

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PostSubject: Flywheels??   Wed Sep 12, 2012 8:53 pm

Fascinating!

Right side flywheel large -- and is that a cutaway on the left...??
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Trevor Amos



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Registration date : 2010-08-13

PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Thu Sep 13, 2012 3:27 am

Mike ,
As you say , a few interesting things to see , but good heavens it looks like someone has been quarying in there , step up on quality control
and performance will improve proportionately !

Trevor
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tonydavis

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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Thu Sep 13, 2012 8:02 am

Thanks for sharing those Mike and thanks to Tom. I would imagine this is still in devolopement but some interesting ideas. Not had the pleasure of sprinting this motor yet though think Tom did offer it to me earlier in the season. What's the characteristics when you rode it Mike peaky? much midrange? what did it rev to?

Good stuff

Just goes to show there's still lots of different ways to wring a chickens neck Laughing

Tony
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Ned

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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Thu Sep 13, 2012 10:25 am

Trevor I'v seen the inside of quite a few motors prepared by Tom and Mick and this ones definitely not finished to their usual standard. So I'm guessing it's still a work in progress.

Mike Love the change of description, no more images of 100e's Laughing
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Trevor Amos



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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Thu Sep 13, 2012 7:36 pm

Ned ,

I am quite sure that you are correct , not finished , a work in progress , but there seems to be so much metal removed in crucial areas that there is
none left to actually work with !

A synergistic and cohesive blending of gas flow phases is what is needed , what i see is just a little chaotic , but that is just my evaluation of what i see
based upon what is what is offered !

But this is indisputably an interesting attempt at progress and boundary pushing , and as such , deserves to be applauded , loudly !

Trevor
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Ned

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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Thu Sep 13, 2012 9:18 pm

Hi Trevor I understand and respect your thoughts. It would be good to hear Toms explanation, unfortunately although I know he looks in on this site Tom has never liked putting pen to paper or speaking in public. I assume Sticky had some involvement with this motor so perhaps he could enlighten us.
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Trevor Amos



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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Thu Sep 13, 2012 11:56 pm

Ned ,
Getting Tom on here , airing his thoughts , would indeed be a treat for all of us , perhaps
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Trevor Amos



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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Fri Sep 14, 2012 12:08 am

OOPS ,
Seem to have been the victim of a computer glitch , that sent before i completed the post ! 2nd attempt .


Ned ,
Getting Tom on here , airing his thoughts , would indeed be a treat for all of us , perhaps his extensive clientele could bring collective
persuasion to bear and get him posting .
Or at the least get " young " Mick S to arm twist !

Trevor
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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Fri Sep 14, 2012 4:05 am

Tom has always said his sprint engines come last and use the old from the race bikes, how ever there is more effort to be put in now he knows the concept works in practice and not just on paper and the pc and I'm sure that it will be once the season is over and the planed winter improvements on all his race enginges are Compleate.

As for tom posting I don't ever see that happening it took 65 years for him to turn a computer on and he has lots of turning milling grinding polishing and cutting to do aswell as all the phone calls so he just wouldn't have the time he hasn't got enough as it is lol
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Ned

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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Fri Sep 14, 2012 10:39 am

iscutt wrote:

As for tom posting I don't ever see that happening it took 65 years for him to turn a computer on

Tom thinks posting is something Mary is obliged to do after she has written the addresses on his Christmas cards. santa Laughing Laughing Laughing
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john bass

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PostSubject: I don´t blame him...   Sat Sep 15, 2012 3:14 am

I don´t blame him -- I sometimes wish I hadn´t bothered with this bluddy thing. Ok so I know I don´t have to use it but once you have sent e-Mails and things there´s no end to it -- forever having to reply...
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mjpowell

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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Sat Sep 15, 2012 5:46 am

I think the great things about these pic's that there is a lot of detail of technical bits
and pieces that no-one has picked up on? (the side reed bit is not actually the most
interesting part). Not absolutely sure but think it may be the old Jimmy/snowy cylinder
given another bite of the cherry in another guise. Rod is ex-jimmy/snowy.
Tom is definately the most successful bantam engine builder/tuner with 20!! Bantam Championships
to his credit...

Mike
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Trevor Amos



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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Sat Sep 15, 2012 8:30 am

Mike,
Don`t assume for one moment that the technical bits haven`t been picked up on , it is merely in repectful deference that opinions have not been aired fully !
Your defence of Tom does you great credit , loyalty is a rare and commendable charactor trait , i for one salute you for it .
However , i am sure that you would conceed , no one gets every thing right for all of the time , at least , i never have ?

Trevor
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TERRY



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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Mon Sep 17, 2012 4:18 am

Trevor Amos wrote:
Mike,
Don`t assume for one moment that the technical bits haven`t been picked up on ? Trevor

I Have to agree with Trevor, there are some interesting mods here,
I took a close look at this engine in the lydden paddock, reminds me of
a early rotax, nothing like a bantam !, its nice to look at photo's,
with an explanation of what it is your trying to show us, rather than a
guessing
or competition. also you would need a complete machine shop to do most
if not all of these mods, way beyond most people resources at home,
to compete with the current crop of engines is difficult enough,
we really should get back to Bantam racing reality, and stick to
a formula in the spirit not just our interpretation of the rules,
I found it interesting to look at, and certainly a lot of work,
the quality control bit for sure would be sorted, ! not sure
how this type of post can be seen as being helpful to
builders of bantam racers, or informative!, very boarderline,
in terms of what the BSA Bantam Formula should be or is
all about, like a few others I can think of.

I think it would be easier or simpler to bolt in an aprilia 125
engine or barrel seems, it would be more achieveable to take
an engine to and engineering shop and ask them to do this,
is all this work really required. !

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ted

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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:01 am

Hi all, Terry Good to see you posting. I think that you are probably not an old Bantam rider/builder; it has always been an engineer’s class. Going back to the nineteen fifties before the club or formula had started, people were water cooling and having special castings made to improve the power of Bantams. It has never been a class for people with no machines in there shed and no welding access. If you want to enjoy Formula Bantam racing you should like developing a bike to the best level you can, as you get better at it you get better still and have a lot of fun. I have built many Bantams, bought some and improved them. I have built some of the slowest Bantams but people have still had fun on them (the early 2000 11 BHP bike to name just one) I have also built some winners. My strategy has been reliability over speed (I think we have had 6 seconds in the championship and one second and third). I have not always had machine shop facilities and only have a small lathe, mill and set of gas cylinders now, all could be bought at a price within a budget any one starting racing should have.
There are bike for sale that can win races or even championships. So it is not hard to start having the most fun you will have in your life. Please don’t knock to class and suggest making it easier to build one “in the spirit” of Bantams that’s what we do now.
Smiffy.
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john bass

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PostSubject: Need friends too....   Mon Sep 17, 2012 9:19 pm

Right Ted -- it is also a good thing to have a few reliable friends to help out when the going´s tough. Having the well-paid but time-consuming job I had at that time meant I couldn´t always be sure of attending a meeting I´d entered for... The East Enders were a good crowd but sometimes I found myself all alone with a touchy Bantam and Andy´s 250 and memory has it that at Lydden I was late getting there and neither would fire up before practice finished... I was total kaputt, lying on my back on my trailer when Chris Newport popped up from nowhere and lent his 6-cylinder Italian special otherwise I´d have not even had a "ride" around the circuit***.

Nothing to do with a Side Reed Motor -- of course -- but distinctly time for a racing Bantam anthem.
There must be talent in the Bantam ranks so come on let´s have one for Cadwell. Something like: "Haitch-R save our gracious Bantams ---Long Live Our Noble Bantam -- Long may its name remain -- etc...etc...etc... " That is because the racing Bantam looks really sweet & divine with its skirt on....²²²

Time someone made up a hymn to keep the Bantam among the racers....

***I think I said this before -- but why not repeat something GOOD of the BRC club spirit ...!!
²²²I really mean it.

Cheers!
JayBee.........
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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Tue Sep 18, 2012 2:24 am

That's a shame didn't realise you were at lydden terry had I known you were there with Dereck I would have poped up and said hello
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mjpowell

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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Tue Sep 18, 2012 7:35 am

Hi Terry I'm surprised you posted what you have? after messaging me to ask about my 'new side reed valve' where i
explained that it was Tom's sprint engine and probaly wouldn't grace a race meeting again. As the post is no help to
anyone i have removed it. Terry i think the class you should concentrate on the 175 class...

If anyone would like to see the pictures p.m. me
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Trevor Amos



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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:25 am

Hi Mike ,
Now that is is a great shame , i can`t vouch for anyone else , but i personally gleaned a shed full of good information from the pictures . So in that
context they were of great help !
Concept , execution and forward intention for the smaller 125cc class , it`s all there , i suspect ?
Don`t be too hard on those you see as detractors , you may not agree with their view , but they do have a perfect right to express it , wouldn`t you agree ?

Trevor



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john bass

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PostSubject: Put it back...   Tue Sep 18, 2012 5:33 pm

Hi Mike! -- put it back -- the post with the pics I mean.

I wanted to have another look and it´s gone... And you did NOT answer my query relative the flywheels -- on the reed side the diameter is smaller than the other side --rIght?

You will have to answer that at Cadwell on Sunday 'cos I´m just off to Düsseldorf to catch a plane (if they are not on strke) to Brum to go to my sister´s place for a couple of days, then my old army college after which it is Chelmsford and Andrew Boyle stc -- etc...

And Mike, bring that broken lay-shaft to Cadwell -- and do try to behave like the gentleman I know you are.

Cheers!

JayBee.
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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:13 am

I say put them back up mike it shows that there and many avenues for people to explore or want to think outside the box but within the rules what is good with our class is every bike is different and not made quicker by an hrc part number and a months wages.
Don't stop people seeing what can be done and it dosent need a factory to achieve,because of 1 negative person
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Ned

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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Wed Sep 19, 2012 10:01 am

You don't need welders or laths in your shed. Finding someone to do welding or machining is easy, be it for your wife's banger or a racer.
Knowing what to machine or weld requires more effort. Wink
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175 Racer

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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:41 pm

Mike,

Please repost the images, I had not finished looking at them or showing them to people yet or working out if I think it really is worth the effort vs some other equally challenging options.

There is plenty of room for all views. Both those of us who wish to can continue with the engineering challenge a Formula Bantam presents and for those that wish to retain that authentic look and feel of course they have the best of both worlds as they can race in both the Bantam Championship but also remain eligible for Events 2a,2b,7 depending on the bikes age, where staying with era specific engineering IS actually a requirement.

If you want to get up the front work harder and ride faster, that's what we are trying to do and will continue to do just takes time, lots of it :-)

cheers



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mjpowell

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PostSubject: Re: Side Reed Motor...   Sat Sep 22, 2012 7:32 am

(Some) Pic's back by popular demand... for some reason can't post some of them?? But i'll try again later...

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