RAF Debden

I am a motorsport enthusiast and due to having grown up around 2-3 miles from RAF Debden, I have a local interest in it.

I am currently researching its usage as a motorsport venue. I've been told that the Bantam Racing Club held races at Debden in the 1970's. Is anyone able to shed any more light on this? Any information at all would be gratefully received and would be much appreciated.

Thank you,

Rob

Hi Rob!
We -- the BRC, I mean -- did not use RAF Debden from 1967 to 1974... and I don´t think the club used it before that. Our Ned Query will surely know... During that period the regular circuits that stick in mind were Snetterton, Lydden, Cadwell and Llandow with a couple of meetinggs at Thruxton and of course we had Bantam races in with VMCC meetings at places like Brands and Silverstone.
Cheers! John Bass.

Hi John!

Thanks for a prompt reply. I thought I'd follow up the lead in case anything came of it. I'll post what I was told below in case it rings any bells with anyone.

Quote :

Debden was also used for bike racing in the 1970s by the Bantam RC. I went to a few of the meetings and they were very enjoyable. The circuit layout was very different from that shown earlier in the thread and must have measured about 2 miles round.

Also,

Quote :

...and the bike circuit turned right at the intersection of the runways and went off to the left of the picture to a hairpin and then back along the peri track to the northern point of the central runway

Here is the picture that is being referred to.

As a last resort, are you aware of any other (perhaps smaller?) organisations calling themselves the Bantam Racing Club during the 70's? If not it could be that my source has muddled up the organising club.

Thanks for the help,

Rob

Hi rjc, this is a subject close to my heart because my parents had the White Hart pub at Wimbish, just up the road. It was the place to be for innebriated racers during race weekends and a lot of fun was had there. The Bantam racing club was the only organization that used the venue to my knowledge. The only other organizations were gliding clubs. It was a typical airfield circuit, very wide straights and most corners were pretty roomy with the odd bottleneck, especially the second where I always scattered the cones with my knee . Hope this helps mate, any more info you need and i'll do my best to be of help.

Hi Mick!

Thanks for posting your memories of Debden. I'm so pleased that this lead has been validated. Unfortunately I'm too young to have seen any of the racing at Debden, which is a shame because it sounds like it had a really fun atmosphere.

I'm from Saffron Walden, which is literally a minute or two down the road from Debden. I know Wimbish fairly well. I was astonished recently to discover that Debden had been (and still is if you include sprints) a racing venue and was amazed that its history wasn't documented all that well. So I'm setting out to rectify this.

Are there likely to be any results or even event programmes archived from the BRC Debden meetings? I know that a lot of clubs don't have archives stretching back all that far but I guess I'm asking on the off-chance that something might exist.

Another thing I'm interested in is the circuit layout. From what I have heard, it is quite different to the circuit that was used for car racing. Could I have a description of the circuit layout, using the overhead layout, so that I can make up a diagram?

Thanks,

Rob

Hi Rob,
There is some Archive information with the paperwork that I have for the club, I will look and see what is available, maybe some of the riders out there (Chris Bennion in particular) will remember the team races at Debden, and I believe that a program still exists that shows that race. I could find and scan that up for you when time allows.
I dont think that Debden was used a lot but I remember it well for the team race race in particular.
All best,
Alan

Yep, I remember the team races well, I was in the winning Eastern centre team in 1978?(riding one of Ted Smith's bikes) i think(also took it to 4th in the championship race if i remember correctly). There is a pic on the forum somewhere of the team. I was looking at the aerial view and recognized it immediately but can't for the life of me remember the first section after the start, did it go up the other runway or turn right on the perimeter road further up? I think it must have been the runway because I certainly don't remember such a long drag from the startline. I think the first corner was mickey moused a little with cones to make it tighter. The aerial view was taken much later than when we used to race on it because Carver barracks is operational and the new REME buildings can clearly be seen. All the houses and workshops wern't there when we used it. I mention the REME buildings because I worked on them as a pipe fitter/welder when they were first constructed . I got on well with the army when they moved in, especially as the officers used my parents pub. My workshop was still in the stables adjoining the pub while i lived in Saffron Walden. The officers let me use the old track and runway for testing. I think the army moved in towards the end of 78 and early 79 as i definately tested my RD250 there which i rode in 79. All i gotta do now is try and remember that first section, the rest of the track is pretyy self explanatory with the last right hander tightening up before the start/finish. That is bottom right near the warm up area, the army vehicles are pretyy much parked up where the old paddock was, near the hangar.
By the way, just to put JB right, the first Debden meeting for the BRC would, i'm pretty sure be in 1976 but i may be wrong. I was living in London then and I distinctly remember taking my 350 Bultaco TSS there.

Hi Alan,

Thanks for all your help! I would really appreciate it if you could see what was available.

Out of curiosity, how did the BRC end up using Debden for racing? Car racing had not taken place at Debden for ten years at this point due to a car leaving the track and reaching the public road. I believe the MSA wanted a barrier installed before a permit would be re-issued. I take it there were no such problems with getting a permit for bike racing?

Once again, thanks all of you, it is most appreciated.

Rob

I think the first meeting we had was in July or Aug 1976. It was certainly before Sept. I remember it because I was trying out my TZ250C, just purchased from Bob Towse. Colin Scarborough on a TD2B gave me a hard time in getting 2 wins in the open 250 race.

I might still have the programme.

I'm sure the BRC went on to run meetings for a couple of years agfter that.

Mary Styles (Tom Miller's sister) was instrumental in getting approval for our being there.

Hope this helps

It's frustrating not being able to remember the layout especially as it was Pete.S, Tom and myself that designed it. The problem I have trying to recall it is not being able to get West Rainham out of my mind which was Simla. A lot of work was involved in setting the circuit up especially for the first meeting. Equipment had to be obtained to meet ACU approval. Lots of stakes, rope, cones, signs, Etc. Most was donated by our employers but we forgot to tell them.!!!
Measuring the circuit was fun. Tom drove his van round with me hanging out the back holding a wheel measurer thingy, with Pete hanging on to me by my belt and calling instructions to Tom.
Mary found out that as was the case with West Rainham, the resident CO had the authority to ok events. She did her PRO job on him and as there was only a skeleton crew in residence he gave the thumbs up.
Unfortunately after a couple of years we were told a battalion was moving in and racing wouldn't be possible.

One section I can remember is - a slowish right hander followed by a short sprint before going in to a fast left hander before the final right hand bend going on to the home straight.
When I say the let hander was fast it depended on your nerve. If you were trying hard you would drift out wider and find a ridge in the surface just when you were fully cranked over. That would cause lighter bikes to skip, and the first couple of times your heart to come up in your mouth.
But Debden was very grippy and the bike never moved off line. So once you had it sussed you could pass a lot of riders not prepared to try it.

Funny I have no problems remembering the pork pie's & mustard in the White Hart

Once again, thank you all!

I'm really enjoying reading these

Debden airfield was used three times by the BRC, on 28 Aug 1976, 19 June 1977 and finally on 25 June 1978.
I have all three programmes, but these are currently stored away following a house move. Cardboard boxes all look the same until opened!
The start-finish was about 1/3 the way down a wide runway straight. A slow 180 degree right hander at the end of this straight was followed by a 90 degree left onto another wide and bumby runway slightly downhill. Another slightly faster 180 degree right hander followed with the track going slightly uphill to a fast 90 degree left hander and onto a Clearways sort of bend that tightened up as it entered the start - finish straight. This bend was closest to the hangers and huts. Lap length was about 1.8 miles. Grid capacity was 40 machines. The Senior Bantams were lapping in about 1min 45 secs and the Novice Bantams in about 2min 00secs.
Can confirm the beer in the White Hart went down quite well, even if the Eastern lot did narrowly beat the Cheshire mob at darts!

Cor!
You lot -- pooh to you! What of my sensitivity... Think of what I missed...!
Let´s see... at about that time I came over from Canada in winter time. Went for Speedway practice at Hackney Wick. Wobbleyman collected me
from the stadium and took me to the BRC dinner as a non-paying guest -- still in my filthy leathers...
Anyone remember that?
B..... silly really!
Anybody got a bike to lend me for the 1/2 Century Parade?
Cheers! JayBee.

bennion, going from your description I've tried to piece together the track layout. Could this be it?

bennion wrote:

Debden airfield was used three times by the BRC, on 28 Aug 1976, 19 June 1977 and finally on 25 June 1978.
I have all three programmes, but these are currently stored away following a house move. Cardboard boxes all look the same until opened!

Thanks for the information! Is there any chance you could scan the programmes for me when you're all settled?

Rob

Rob!
Before I shut up (did someone shout hurrah!) -- just a question you might be able to answer, re soppy nostalgia (since I am stuck here in Deutschland and was born in Essex...) -- nothing to do with BRC or motor racing...
Do you know -- or can you find out -- when the British Army first used Debden after the RAF had finished using it for war... I have a feeling it was a massive transit car-park, used by the Ordnance or Service Corps(RASC) in 1947. All manner of road and off-road vehicles lined those runways, where those mad-young-things hurled trhemselves along -- 29-30 years later...
I´d tell you the reason for asking but these wild young creatures with rings in their ears & noses, and tattoos just about everywhere(?), would make abusive noises about `Old Gitts cluttering up their chat lines´ -- or some such ... if I did.
Thanks & cheers! JayBee.

Glad you guys remember my parents pub, had some good do's in there and it was even used for committee meetings for a while, Ned and me both served at that time, bloody handy for me of course.

On the committee, not behind the bar !

Hi Rob,
As far as I can remember, your idea of the circuit, is as I remember it. I rode there once, in 1976 I believe, in the Open 125cc race.
As usual my Yam expired on the last lap, with one corner to go! Lofty Elliot and I came onto the main straight on one lap, Lofty ran wide onto the grass, but still came back onto the track in front of me. Great fun.
Great circuit that left lasting memories.

LOL, Ned, mind you we always could have taken over behind the bar, me old mum and dad thought you were a g'dun. Pete, nice to see you here, Lofty Elliot, now theres a name I remember well, me and him had some almighty piss ups at the yearly do's, regularly stripping off to zorba the greek if i remember, lol, wotta laugh.